Women Criticize Vatican Document on Feminism

Amos Stevens

New Member
Women Criticize Vatican Document on Feminism
Sun Aug 1, 2004 08:50 AM ET


By Philip Pullella
VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Women have reacted with anger
and amusement to a Vatican document on feminism, with
some saying the Catholic Church is run by men who live
in a time warp and want to keep women in their place.

The document, issued Saturday, said modern feminism's
fight for power and gender equality was undermining
the traditional concept of family and creating a
climate where gay marriages are seen as acceptable.

Frances Kissling, president of the U.S.-based
Catholics for a Free Choice, said she thought she had
"passed through a time warp" when she read the
document.

"I thought for sure I was the 1960s and Archie Bunker
had been appointed theologian to the Pope," she said,
referring to the character in an old American TV
series whose bigoted views included opposition to any
form of women's rights.

In a 37-page document "On the Collaboration of Men and
Women in the Church and in the World," the Vatican
said women should be respected and have equal rights
in the workplace, but differences between the sexes
must be recognized and exalted.

The document, which re-stated Catholic Church
positions, including the ban on female priests, said
that many women felt they had to be "adversaries of
men" in order to be themselves.

It criticized feminism's attempt to erase gender
differences, saying it had inspired ideologies
questioning the traditional family structure of a
mother and a father and making homosexuality and
heterosexuality virtually equivalent.

"Such observations could only be made by men who have
no significant relationships with women and no
knowledge of the enormous positive changes the women's
rights movement has meant for both men and women,"
Kissling said.


YESTERDAY'S WORLD?

Emma Bonino, a former European commissioner and
current member of the European parliament, said the
Vatican was writing about a world that she said no
longer exists.



"This letter could easily have been written by an imam
of al-Azhar," she said referring to Sunni Islam's most
respected institution of religious learning in Cairo.
"To be fair to the Catholic Church, no religion is a
great friend of women," she told the Corriere della
Sera newspaper. "They pay you a lot of compliments but
when push comes to shove they ask you to stay in your
place: wife, nurse, mother and grandmother."

The document said that although motherhood is a "key
element of women's identity," women should not be
considered from the sole perspective of procreation.

It said women who choose to be full-time mothers
should not be stigmatized and it appealed to
governments to make it easier for mothers to hold
outside jobs without "relinquishing their family
life."

Some women suggested that the Vatican was taking a
patronizing attitude that it would not take toward
men.

"Everyone knows that men and women are different and
the feminist movement has always held this view," said
Chiara Saraceno, a professor of sociology at the
University of Turin.

"What continues to shock me is this teaching attitude
that is always directed at women and never at men,"
she told the leftist newspaper L'Unita.

© Reuters 2004. All Rights Reserved.
 

Serena

Administrator
I was born and raised a Catholic. And I look on just about all of their attitudes towards women with amusement and this: ---------> :rolleyes:

After all, they have to have SOME excuse for all those child molestation charges, eh? :rolleyes:

"with some saying the Catholic Church is run by men who live in a time warp and want to keep women in their place." I would say this quote sums up my feelings about the Catholic church. A group of men who are not allowed to be married or have relationships with women. :rolleyes:

I think I sprained my eyeballs on this one. :rolleyes: :D

Thanks, Amos. :)
I read this as soon as I got home from Sunday mass. :D
 

TDWoj

Administrator
Staff member
Yes, the one thing I've noticed is that the Vatican is always - ALWAYS - painting women as if they were some kind of evil second class citizen (I'm Catholic, by the way, and some days it's very hard....) whilst the men get off scot-free. I've never seen a tract condemning men who rape, men who kill women, men who diddle little boys whether they wear a priestly collar or not - but it's the WOMEN's fault that what is defined as a "family" is falling apart! It's the WOMEN's fault same sex couples want to be married!

St. Thomas Aquinas was the one who started all this rubbish against women - when he found an essay by Aristotle who defined women as "aberrations", and co-opted it into a tract of his own, which the church then embraced, and then it was all over for women having any kind of role in the church.

But it's also true that very few religions see women as anything but second-class citizens. Female-oriented religions, like wicca, for example, are seen as evil and the devil's work.

It was interesting, back when I was going to church regularly, that the farther away one got from the administrative centre - the Archdiocese - the more relaxed the "rules" became. For example, you won't see a woman minister of communion or lector, or girls as altar servers at the Cathedral - but get out of town, and you'll see them all over the place. Once, we had the Monsignor from the Archdiocese of Toronto come to our church. On that Sunday, there were no altar girls, I was not allowed to be lector, and the ministers of communion were all men.

Grrr!
 

Jalu

Steve's Destiny
Thanks Amos....

I with you Serena...specially on the child molestation thing.



Serena said:
I was born and raised a Catholic. And I look on just about all of their attitudes towards women with amusement and this: ---------> :rolleyes:

After all, they have to have SOME excuse for all those child molestation charges, eh? :rolleyes:

"with some saying the Catholic Church is run by men who live in a time warp and want to keep women in their place." I would say this quote sums up my feelings about the Catholic church. A group of men who are not allowed to be married or have relationships with women. :rolleyes:

I think I sprained my eyeballs on this one. :rolleyes: :D

Thanks, Amos. :)
I read this as soon as I got home from Sunday mass. :D
 

Hallarian

New Member
Always been puzzled by this?????

This extreme bias against women in many religions is difficult to understand. It seems as if women are blamed for some men's difficulties with their own faith. Attitudes of some muslims and catholics is severe but also orthodox judaism. It's weird.
 

yudansha

TheGreatOne
That was interesting. Thanks, Amos.

I'm not Catholic. I'm Orthodox, and I haven't seen any 'bias' towards women when I grew up. The only major thing I know, is that almost always, it were the men who were in charge of their families (here today, you see many women who 'wear the pants in the family' ... or so the saying goes)... Interesting nonetheless...
 

kickingbird

candle lighter
There has been and still is bias against women in a lot of the world religions; mainly because those who "established" those religions (i'm talking about the religions themselves, not the prophets who brought the teachings), were men. In the Essences - the early Christian mystics - women were and are considered equal to men. The same holds true in early Islamic mystics -the Sufis - who hold women in reverence. However, it is in the worldly traditions, the tribal mentality, that women are delegated as second-hand beings. Some of it stems from the fact that the patriachal camp wanted their religions to be spread around; hence the silencing of females believed to be "witches", therefore "evil".
Sometimes it all comes down to the fact that some men simply couldn't and can't keep their appetites in tow; hence it is easier to blame women for their urges and to put women out of sight than to deal with "it".
As far as the vatican and their sexist propaganda - how sad. I wonder what Jesus would say? He did, in fact, have many women who cared for him, who were actually his closest disciples. Without looking to the Bible for answers, it would be nice to hear from the Man Himself :) , don't you think?
 
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